lose/lose

By: Derek Yu

On: September 23rd, 2009

“”http://www.stfj.net/art/2009/loselose/“>Lose/Lose is a video-game with real life consequences. Each alien in the game is created based on a random file on the player’s computer. ”color: #F26522">*If the player kills the alien, the file it is based on is deleted.* If the player’s ship is destroyed, the application itself is deleted."

Created by Zach Gage. Nope, I haven’t tried it! (By the way, this is not one of the “great playable games” I mentioned in the last post.)

(Source: f00m@nB@r, via Sensible Erection [NSFW?])

Posted in Macintosh, Shoot-em-ups, Unique / Bizarre, Videos | Tags: ZachGage

Anthony Flack

It seems that some people are awfully easily impressed.

Hey, if you want to be confronted with stark real-life consequences in a pointless game, try lying on your bed and flicking lit matches into the corners of your room.

Of course, you’re not going to actually DO that. Just the fact that I made you think about doing it makes me a brilliant artist though, right?
Mischief Maker

Still, I would be a lot less embarassed screwing up my computer by playing this game than I would be by getting moved to tears by “Passage.”
thebeefiest

This should be a facebook app to shoot delete all the friends, and try to avoid the people you actually do know.
Epitaph64

I have a better game. It’s called win/win. It involves not playing lose/lose. >:D
whom

…FUCK NO!
TCM

@Anthony Flack:

There is a piece of art that is literally a giant blank wall.

It has been called awe inspiring.

Yes, according to the art world, you are now a brilliant artist.
Butofcourse

This is an incredible game and I highly recommend all you sour sacks play it! The fun isn’t in playing the game, it’s in the rebuilding of your hard drive. It’s beautiful. It could have been frustrating but when forced to re-install and rebuild entire sections of applications and the windows file system you actually see the beauty in it. There are far too many useless files in the System32 folder anyway! Documents and Settings, SAY GOODNIGHT!

I love this game. What a novel idea. Of course, like any game, the novelty will wear off eventually, but for now I’m hooked!
CT

Worst idea ever.
Cliftor

I’d just like to add my voice to the cacophony sounding off that this “game” is complete bullshit.

Now, it’s not clever. It hasn’t subtley and insidiously caused us to reconsider any of the basic assumptions we have about anything.

It’s inane and puerile to give this “game” credit for anything, as a game or a concept. See, as a game it fails because it’s designed to discourage you from playing it at all. As a concept it’s stupid because there’s nothing deep or interesting about being warned off of something and us heeding the warning.

If I told you that I rigged a manhole somewhere in your city to explode in your face if you removed it (I tell you where it is), what purpose have I accomplished, what meaning or message have I conveyed? I’ve just warned you to avoid getting gibbed. How the hell is that art or even an interesting mental exercise?

My biggest fear is that some self-satisfied game designer is looking at this thread, sitting back in his chair, rubbing his hands and patting himself on his back, congratulating himself on a job well done. What indulgent, self-congratulatory nonsense!
nhutto

personally i think this is awesome. I am gonna create a similar game but network it and also make the files risk based. so you can prevent like deleting your kernal.
http://mile222.com aeiowu

@Anthony

I understand what you’re saying, but take a step back for a second. Doesn’t a work of art that makes the viewer/player think about it and influence their life a solid work?

Games are all about choices, right? Not only does lose/lose give you a deeply meaningful choice (which is strangely rare) but that meaningful choice comes before you even see the title screen. It’s the choice to play the game.
Jay

Although I’m not jumping at the chance to play this game, I do think it’s a very interesting concept.

I also think it’s sad that people are so afraid of it. It’s clear they just don’t understand it.

Plus, deleting any or all files from your computer’s hard drive doesn’t break it or ruin it any more than disconnecting your cable box breaks your TV.
Jay

Also, it certainly is a game. If I saw a bunch of kids playing with water guns and traded them their water guns for handguns, is it any less of a game? I don’t believe it says anythings about a game having to be safe in its definition.

“A game is a structured activity, usually undertaken for enjoyment and sometimes used as an educational tool.” –Wikipedia
judgespear

By all means then Jay, knock yourself out.
judgespear

and if games like this start becoming a trend I’m going to go invest in a good virtual machine or run all my games through Sandboxie.
Ezuku

Naturally I didn’t d/l it, but it’s an interesting concept which made me think for a bit.

I rofled @ ateam’s second post. Very epic.
EToaster

You know, there are actually quite a lot of games where you have weapons but try to avoid killing things recklessly… so I’m not sure what the point of this whole thing was.
Noyb

A pretentious virus? Now I’ve seen everything.

Interesting idea, but does anyone remember that Doom mod a while back in which each enemy was a random process on your computer, and killing one ended that process (the kill command as it were)? Similar concept, lower stakes.

That said, I don’t think this is a compelling examination of the consequences of violence in games. Adding a punishment system outside of the game feels forced. Don’t shoot aliens in a game, because the game might be a malware that deletes your files?

Is it trying to implant empathy for life through an appeal to materialism? That is, does it want you to value a life like you would a personal possession? The metaphor is stretched impossibly thin since a life cannot be copied, but a file can. Is virtual murder fine and dandy when you have a boot disk and have backed up your important data?

Might just be my humanist beliefs coming through, but I’d much rather see a game that tries to make the player adopt a non-violent play style through the gameplay itself and not a system of external punishments.

I tried to make an anti-shmup like that in the past Ludum Dare. Collecting objects gave significantly more points than killing. Enemies took so many shots to kill that they put you in awkward and dangerous situations if you tried. One enemy barreled dangerously down the center at high speeds whenever you shot while it was onscreen. Stalactites shook the whole screen when you shot them down, making it hard to navigate for a short time. These are all behaviors and rules *within the game* that immediately and predictably make the player’s task of attaining a high score much more difficult if he chooses to be violent. It’s not the best design, but I bring it up merely as an example of another way to approach this issue. I’d love to hear better examples!
Ateam

I have an idea for the video game if you rea-

YOU JUST READ THIS SENTENCE YOU MUST DELETE YOUR HARD DRIVE OR DON’T DELETE YOUR HARD DRIVE

I just made an art
Alex May

Figures Rod Humble approves hehe

I agree with Anthony Flack.
Anthony Flack

aeiowu, it’s not really such a meaningful choice though, is it? To play or not to play. Because of course I’m not going to play it. I doubt I would have played it even if it didn’t delete my files.
Ateam

replace deleting files with ending lives and you have the plot to Gamer

modify it some more to where you die if an alien comes along and you have the plot to another hollywood movie

you just elevated video games to the level of movies!
jimmykane

“Plus, deleting any or all files from your computerâ€™s hard drive doesnâ€™t break it or ruin it any more than disconnecting your cable box breaks your TV.”

No-one’s worried about their hard drive, they’re worried about their files/OS.
FrankieSmileShow

I am wondering how the game can access random files and delete them, though. Wouldn’t that mean the game has way more “rights” than it should have? Can any program really just access and delete any file on your computer? I thought there was something that kept programs from normally accessing things outside its own directory, so does this circumvent these security measures somehow?
Anthony Flack

You know, it probably doesn’t. It’s probably a total bluff.
Linus

@FrankieSmileShow:
So, notepad is a virus now?
Cooper

On the few times I’ve seen this linked to, none of the posts have noted that it’s a Mac only game. Guess no one’s actually bothered trying to play it?
Leonardo

” Sergio said about 21 hours later:
The guy who made Pasta Master already made a game with roughly this concept, done slightly better I would say. ”
Ugh, seriously. That guy is plain crazy.

This concept is neat. I would like to try it if I had to format my Mac. But I don’t have one, so EPIC FAIL! Make a Windows version and we got a deal.
Gutter

This game is like a museum that promise to kill one of your kids for every painting you look at.

I’ve seen some argue that you didn’t have to shoot, so really it was your choice and that was the statement of the game, but the problem is that it is a game, it’s meant to be played. I wouldn’t go to that museum to ignore all the painting, so why would I play that game? I wouldn’t even call that place a museum, I’d call it a gas chamber, just like I call that game a virus.
TCM

@Gutter:

The arguement doesn’t work.

Like I said on RPS, you don’t actually need to shoot to have fun, dodge the enemies instead.

‘course, I’m not about to play it. Nor do I necessarily agree with the author.
Mipe

Russian roulette of the Mac gaming!
Alwaysright

You people are all pussies. This game is all about who has a nutsack and who doesn’t. Out of the entire commentary it seems as though only two people here have the balls to actually play the game.

That’s it, there’s nothing else to it. You either will play it knowing what will happen and proving that you actually have a scrotum or you won’t play it knowing would will happen if you do proving that you’re a pussy. The choice is yours, but no matter which choice you make you still fall into one of two categories. So you’re smart because you didn’t play the game… Yeah, but you’re still a pussy. Just like the title implies, only the game wins.

Now stop your whining and either step up and show you have a pair, or step off and just be a pussy. Quite simple really, stop going for the deep analysis of such a simple game.
Alwaysright

You people are all pussies. This game is all about who has a nutsack and who doesn’t. Out of the entire commentary it seems as though only two people here have the balls to actually play the game.

That’s it, there’s nothing else to it. You either will play it knowing what will happen and proving that you actually have a scrotum or you won’t play it knowing would will happen if you do proving that you’re a pussy. The choice is yours, but no matter which choice you make you still fall into one of two categories. So you’re smart because you didn’t play the game… Yeah, but you’re still a pussy. Just like the title implies, only the game wins.

Now stop your whining and either step up and show you have a pair, or step off and just be a pussy. Quite simple really, stop going for the deep analysis of such a simple game.
Alwaysright

You people are all pussies. This game is all about who has a nutsack and who doesn’t. Out of the entire commentary it seems as though only two people here have the balls to actually play the game.

That’s it, there’s nothing else to it. You either will play it knowing what will happen and proving that you actually have a scrotum or you won’t play it knowing would will happen if you do proving that you’re a pussy. The choice is yours, but no matter which choice you make you still fall into one of two categories. So you’re smart because you didn’t play the game… Yeah, but you’re still a pussy. Just like the title implies, only the game wins.

Now stop your whining and either step up and show you have a pair, or step off and just be a pussy. Quite simple really, stop going for the deep analysis of such a simple game.
Gutter

@TCM : How does the argument doesn’t work?

I could still go to that “museum” but not look at the artwork. If you went to that museum, would you feel like you are in a museum? Would you suggest to your friends to go to that museum?

How is that different to a game that no one want to play, doesn’t feel like a game if they do, and that they would never suggest to a friend?
anothergol

>>Yeah, but youâ€™re still a pussy.

Mmmh.. pussy or retard? You made your choice, but I pick pussy!
King

@Alwaysright
“DO YUZ HAVE DA BALZ TO DALEETE UR HARDDRIVE?!”

You fucking fool. I pity anyone who would fall for such idiocy.
mariog

Great if you plan to play it in a virtual machine. You’ve got to admit the concept is quite original, though.
snoozenstein

Jay – some of us actually do WORK on our computers and don’t want to risk losing it. WHAT AN ASTONISHING CONCEPT
durrr

I think the term ‘art game’ really indicates as much as a sappy PR kick of a new-gen game. “I’m a gimmicky, barely-playable game made by designers intent on getting across a message that will be more shunned than respected because it fails on every level (all one of them).” But we’ll pass it off as PROVOCATIVE. About as thought-provoking as BMX XXX.

The game fails more than succeeds, if all the posts above me are any indication. Trying to defend this game is ridiculous. The game is something no one wants to touch. And that wasn’t even the point of it, which is even funnier. It should’ve been. It’s the only reason it’s gotten this many comments.

The message they put across is stupid. “Why kill things just because we expect them to be enemies?” It’s not deep, it’s just a stupid question. Who says we’re killing them because they’re enemies? There was no “these shitheads are causing a lot of trouble, please, stop them” intro. No badass robots in violent cut scenes to show us how evil they were. Just a big OH NOES UR FILEZ WATCH OUT. What if part of us just wants to kill shit? What if there is no protagonist? The message should’ve been more comprehensive.

Applying meaning in a philosophical setting requires a philosophy where meaning needs to be applied. Philosophy has higher standards than just asking “WHY?” all the time.
This game is just like every other art game: bland, pretentious, and forgettable. And it’s getting irritating how many games adopt the same stupid self-referential attitude because of these games flooding the indie games circuit. Yeah, we get it, achievements and upgrades are liek so totly lame. So what?

Just read Auntie Pixelante’s blog. Every entry about retro games (a.k.a. charming games with shitty graphics) is filled with completely overblown explanations of every single god damned pixel and movement and colour and level design and character and bit of code. Every post reeks of verbose bullshit. That is art games. Overreaching, say-nothing reflections on bullshit questions nobody else is asking. Because most people will never ever care. It’s great as a curiosity, but they’re less entertaining, even philosophically, than any Gradius or Halo or Mario Party.

Now, I’m going to play some REAL games. Games that aren’t 100% gimmick.
Ateam

“i SHALL MAKE A POST ON THE FORMS” said alwaysright as he gripped his giant balls who werren’t a pussy because he was a man not a woman and he thinks woman suck because they have lady parts not man parts

Alwaysright made a typing on his keyboard and thought ” i shall defend lose/lose from these losers/losers he rpessed a button and his words danubed onto the commend section

“i am in the comment section” said the post as it made a danube

he gripped his balls he knew were there bcause he defends a gmae he rpobably never played.

then earth exploded

the end
SirNiko

The game would be more moving if there was a choice involved. Maybe give players a free copy of some popular console game with the warning that losing at said game will result in their console being bricked.

You need to bait the hook if you’re gonna catch anything.

-SirNiko
nik

this game is art.

with the most response ever in a couple of hours, very good!
nik

this game is art.

with the most response ever in a couple of hours, very good!
Melly

Comments in this frontpage baffle me sometimes.
Bob

I’m going to reformat pretty soon (of course, you could always run it on VMware).
Should be fun.

Also, I hate how the creator tries to slip in a moral message into this.

Bleh.
+peter

Wow… plenty of discussion on this one, simple game. I think the artist accomplished his goal.

I really enjoy where this concept is going.
http://www.g4g.it Firesword

http://sensibleerection.com/images/iconic/drub14.jpg

This is Zach Gabe.. rotfl..

Just joking zach..
Booooring

If this is an art game, it should be judged as both a game and a piece of art. It seems pretty poor as either.

If it’s just a concept game, well then… there it is, maybe kinda clever. That’s all it is. But the second the author injected any sort of “message” into it… LAME.

Ateam is making me laugh.
Jamal

LOL at Ateam!! You are a genius, sir.